is zerodha forsaking PI? it is no longer even mentioned in products page of zerodha (https://zerodha.com/products). PI is more stable than KITE 3.0, but still needs lot of fixes. most traders do like to use PI for its one screen use.
To my understanding:
Pi was mostly used by active day-traders, since it was released back in 2015.
Active day-traders are a minority when considering the Whole Market Participants in the Indian Stock Markets.
A large majority of these active day-traders are having a full time job elsewhere, so they don’t use Pi from their work place.
I have started to notice on many day trading chat rooms , even the active day-traders trading from homes have shifted to KITE a long time back. You do not see any more screenshots of chart analysis from Pi.
So, it is quite understandable why a broker would not waste resources to areas which are not much utilized by a majority of its client base.
Cloud Computing and Virtual Windows Servers will soon replace desktop based application.
Even some of the desktop based platforms provided by other brokers ( which you might be comparing to Pi ) will soon be obsolete in the next 3 -5 years for the lack of continuous Research and Development Funding.
If you still need a desktop trading platform, its time for you to make the transition and look for advanced trading platforms like Amibroker, Ninja or MT4, where there is continuous research and updates.
i disagree with you on your views on pi. Though, its agreed updates are less for pi as compared to kite. But your point of active trader ditching pi is completely baseless. Many traders(full time) including myself prefer and use pi for several good reasons.
Pi is my bread and butter as well as for many who doesn’t comment here on qna.
So, respect pi, end of story. If you are not handy with pi, please don’t diss about it.
This Reminds me of my neighbour who was a Professional Wedding Photographer in the 90’s.
He refused to change his analog camera, when the rest of his friends was adapting to Digital cameras.
20 years later he still has his analog camera, but no place in the Photography Business, while rest of his friends are doing very well.
This is the very same situation.
How funny. Desktop platforms are out of date ??
As per my observation many full time traders use desktop platforms ( Permanent Coustmers which are require for any business to sustain ). New comers and part time traders ( have another source of income ) using web based platforms. These people may quit trading and go away because trading is tough game and they have another source of income.
Neglecting permenant customers is diaster for any business. Zerodha must focus on it.
@nithin KITE3 cannot replace PI. The number of ticks you get in Pi is twice as much in KITE3. Pi is relatively more stable than KITE3.
Zerodha should not abandon Pi and force the half baked KITE3 upon the customers. I am with zerodha for the past 2.5 years and Pi is one of the main reason for that.
Me too will switch to another broker if PI abondon by zerodha.
Kite or any web based application doesn’t inspire confidence for a professional to trade big or trade multiple Instruments, it lags, screws up bad, most of the time the chart just freezes, i have reloaded it so many times just to check the proper price. for an intra-day trader that’s a big disadvantage. those 90% people may not be permanent traders most of them may even be investors but pros usually prefer desktop based application. as it gives confidence, it doesn’t dance around on a browser. Confidence is very important for a trader without it even a winning trade turns to loss.If investing on Desktop based application really costs a lot of money u dont have to build it for free, if u build a very good software pros will pay for it. for someone who trades in lakhs 500-1000 a month on software isn’t an issue. but here PI isn’t that great compared to trade tiger, in trade tiger double click will open chart its so stable, smooth and easy to work on. pi is fast but it really needs fixes, which tradelab is very reluctant to do. ask them to please use trade tiger once and they will know the difference. once i was on short on 10 lots on nifty and PI and kite all froze i could have lost lakhs its my mistake to take excessive risk but its also their mistake when it freezes so the trader cant get out.
I agree with you. Most of the professionals wont feel any burden to pay for stable trading platform.
I think we should just infer the future plans of zerodha and @nithin by looking at what they are doing right now with desktop applications. @nithin /zerodha may seem to be showing no interest on fixing Pi or Nest. But I think they are just pushing kite web/mobile/connect platform. This is a good long term strategy. I congratulate them. I only wish kite is little more polished on various places.
@nithin already mentioned the problems with fixing bugs / making changes to Pi and Nest elsewhere. They are not zerodha’s own products. Omnesys/Reutures should fix Nest and tradelab should fix Pi. Getting new versions and testing them and supporting during initial days of new version rollout are all a too big effort and costly; not to mention the risk IIRC, zerodha had serious problems earlier when rolling out new NEST version. If NEST and Pi has only few users and the software works to an acceptable level, @nithin / zerodha will just leave them to be. And that is easy to understand.
BTW, I believe the NSE NOW, NEST Trader (aka Zerodha Trader) and Pi all use software components from modulusfe.com. It is not only possible, more probable that fixing issues there means zerodha -> Reuters/Omnesys or Tradelab -> modulusfe and all the way back.
That sure is a mess. Especially when remembering how bad the initial days of NEST and Pi were. Either Pi and Nest should die sooner or become very lean and just be a manual execution application as a fall back option if kite platform went down. AFAIK, NEST almost got there.
The NEST Trader was very unstable earlier with nest plus plugin. The application also had many confusing things (looked more like a dealer terminal was botched up as a single user terminal). The new version does not have nest plus and cleaned up many things in the interface. Great progress. Of-course It does not have charts now; but it became a good manual execution platform. The price alerts seem to be working too.
There could be a similar update to Pi where the minor bugs are fixed and the application goes into kind of maintenance mode. But from the complaints I see here on tradingqna about Pi stability, I am not having confidence on Pi to live long.
PI is FAR better than KITE. Trading is pure business and you cannot take your business for granted. One can use kite as a temporary alternative when not available to desktop but people who want to become serious trader, will always choose PI as it is very stable and very user friendly for technical analysis.
whic broker you prefered instead of zerodha
I do hope Pi stays on and work stable. I use it occasionally for analysis and it got one or two features I like very much. But I am not counting on Pi to receive regular updates and becoming more appreciated platform going forward.
main problem with discount broking
I am not yet decided. I have few lakhs of capital for trading. I need assurance to deposit my money. Because most of discount brokers earn thin margins and may blow up one bad day of market.
I trusted zerodha because @nithin is once a successful trader and he know risk management well and now Zerodha is a brand.
I dont know much about other discount brokers but I dont think they are traders once.
I may go to traditional broker instead of choosing other discount broker. May be my cost of trading will raise 10 to 20 thousand per month. But I feel comfort which will bring confidence while trading, Discomfort will bring iritation and we may loose concentration and we may end up with loss.
Now you can easily see the difference between kite & PI. In Stochastic Indicator you cannot see what is happening at the last candle. but in PI You can. Even you can tune it with marginal changes in %K & %D settings, But in Kite there is no option, you can only change period. In MACD also You can easily focus on divergence or Histogram changes but in Kite - all look quite similar and difficult to focus. This happens in other indicators also. We all know - we have to be very precise to win when competitors are very very intelligent.
And 2Hrs, 4Hrs, 6Hrs & 8hrs charts are available on PI but in Kite - only 1Hr chart are available.
So, I personally think that , Pro Traders on ZERODHA only use PI, if not - there is no use of Desktop Platforms like Amibroker, ninja trader or MT4.
Traders who want both side income i.e. from office and from trading rely only on KITE - This is my personal thinking as i see comments here. But Serious traders never rely on web platforms as far as i read and know.
If we want to win WAR, firstly we have to equip with nice weapons on which we have good command, not necessary of latest weapons which commands US.
So, PI is BEST in INDIA and Zerodha is best among other Brokers.
IMO, Desktop “trading” platforms are going out of date, not because of newer web platforms but because of auto/algo trading.
I do prefer a desktop application with good charting and alerting features for trading. Sadly, the applications we get from most/all discount brokers are at best in “barely acceptable” range.
That said, I believe zerodha is better compared to others now.
Is there a great desktop application from any of the discount brokers?
Bulls eye abhishek. well said!! Thats what it is. That’s what that separates men from boys.
No hatred, kite lovers, but Pi as a platform is much stronger than kite.
The only reason there is kite, is because 95% retail traders look for an easy platform. And yes, the broker earns good brokerage from kite users.
And if zerodha were to ditched pi, then i ld certainly switch broker.
And FYI, pi doesn’t crash or hangs on my PC. It crashes if you run on a non maintained PC.
Mine has dual boot. One is a clean OS windows 10 64x Pro, 16 GB ram, dedicated to run only for pi and trade related sites.
Other boot is for usual purposes, porn,movies and shit. Haha, got you!!
So, don’t apply so much brain here. Pi is a good platform, for serious traders.
"02 May 2018, 09:49 AM
Issue with Kite
Due to a connectivity issue, you may face an issue with logging into Kite. We are looking into this and should have this resolved shortly. You can login to Pi or call us or write to us on email@example.com in the meanwhile to place order. "
Today’s KITE server outage is another reason to have Pi as backup.
But I think - It would be best if PI, given utmost care and KITE, taken as backup.