Problems and Queries

Zerodha Zerodha platforms
1

  1. I opened PI to see the MARKET OHLC and then opened KITES to make the order. Suddenly, when I wanted to make the order, PI said, another user is logged in and logged off. Kites said the same.
    Can’t I use PI and Kites simultaneously?
    I want to see the market OHLC of Futures in PI and trade from Kites?

  2. If I want to do this for some FUTURE STOCK:
    BUY 400.50
    Take Profit: 410.10
    Stop Loss: 395.20

Here, BO is very complicated as I have to calculate the difference between BUY and Take Profit and Stoploss so get POINTS and mention that in StopLoss, Take Profit formfields.
I also found that if I want a BO, and want to make a buy at 401, and the market is at 395, my Order is executed as Market Price of 395 and not 401.

This makes it very difficult to use BO. This means I have to wait till the market rise, put the order, below the BUY and then wait to see if the market comes down and hits my BUY price. If it does not and the market rises, my BO will never be triggered.

So, this is very difficult process…

In my scenario of:

BUY 400.50
Take Profit: 410.10
Stop Loss: 395.20

Do, I first place one order of MIS SLM of 401.
Then place another order of SLM of 395.20.
Then place third order of SLM 410.10.

?

So, that means, I place 3 SLM orders each for BUY, TARGET and STOPLOSS?

Please guide.

If, I get to make profits, will I be charged Rs.20 for 2 orders? and the 3rd will not get triggered and I have to manually close it?

The reason I am asking this is because BO, CO is not working nicely here. I lost lot of money as my BUY order triggered at the market price and not the place I wanted it to trigger. I do not want to put the BUY order below the market price as who knows that the market keeps on climbing and never hits my buy target?
So, I thought of 3 orders: MIS SLM for each BUY price, Stop Loss and Take Profit.

Please guide me here the approach I should take for this scenario:

BUY 400.50
Take Profit: 410.10
Stop Loss: 395.20

Thanks.

Angel

2

  1. Yeah, you can’t be simultaneously logged into Kite and PI.

  2. If current price is 400 and you want to buy only at 401 (or any price above 400), it is not possible to enter this way using brackets or covers. To enter this way, you need the ability to enter placing a trigger order. Currently brackets can be used as either limits or markets (place a much higher limit, it becomes a market automatically).

To do what you are trying to do, yes first place a SL-M Buy with trigger price at 401. Once this is executed, place two separate orders, Sell SL-M with trigger at 395.2 and Sell limit order at 410.1

3

Thanks Nitin.

So, in this case, can I do this:
SL-M: 401
SL-M: 395.2
SL-M: 410.1 (why SL, why not SL-M?)
?

Will I be charge Rs.20 for two triggered orders here - so Rs.40? If it was BO, then I would have been just charged Rs.20. right?
And the 3rd order, I assume I need to then manually cancel/exit/close?

Another question:

You said, “place a much higher limit, it becomes a market automatically”.
If I put say 410 while looking at the screen as soon as the market crosses 401, I assume that my order will be triggered at the market level of 401. Please confirm.

So, if in this BO, I have set Stoploss of 5 points and Take Profit of 10 points, will these points be based on the Market order execution or on the 410 value that I typed in to enter the market?

I mean in this case will my StopLoss order be at: 405 or 396?

Thanks.

Angel

4

Last query:
If I have the strategy of:
Buy below: x
SLoss: y
Target: z

And I want to place the order fast (and not wait to calculate the points for SL of x-y or TGT of z-x), do I simply choose 3 MIS SL-M orders for each. or faster would be the CO order with SL value and later set the SL-M Target order?

5

You can use SL or SLM, SL-M ensures guaranteed execution. Check this post.

One entry order and one exit order, so Rs 40. Even in BO it is the same way.

Yes if you place a buy at 410 when market is 401, it is like a market order. It will keep buying upto the price of 510.

In BO, it the SL and profit will be based on execution price and not at which order was placed. So 396

6

Best way is to use bracket for this.

When you enter using cover order, you can’t place a separate target order. The only way is to exit the pending SL order.

Check the videos on SL/Covers/Brackets here.

7

You’re amazing Nitin. Thanks so much.
One more query:

Assuming, I want to do this:
Current Market price: 396
BUY AT 400
SL: 396
TARGET: 410

Can I do this:

A:

  1. open the window and look at the screen. As soon as the price crosses 400, execute a CO order with a stoploss value.
  2. Then create a seperate SLM order at 410.

Now, if the loss gets trigerred, I manually cancel the 410 SLM.
If profit gets triggered, I assume that CO will also exit?

Or,

B:

  1. I look at the scree, It crosses 400, I place a CO order with stop loss value of 396.
  2. I keep on looking at the screen. As soon as it crosses my target area, I manually exit the CO.

Or:

C:

  1. I create BUY SLM at 400
  2. I create SELL SLM at 410
  3. I create SELL SLM at 396

if 410 is hit, I manually close 396.
if 396 is hit, I manually close 400.

Another query:

I see in PI, the quick BUY SELL (but they are limit orders). Shouldn’t Zerodha make it a default quick BUY SELL market execution orders?

Can I do this:

  1. It crosses 400, and I press BUY button from PI.
  2. it crosses 410, and I press SELL button from PI
  3. I create SLM at 396.

Then if 1 gets trigerred, I assume I should manually cancel 3 order?

8

Last query, sorry for asking many questions:

  1. In PI, the quick order windows shows BUY and SELL buttons. They BUY and SELL LIMIT buttons.
    Now, if I want to buy at current market price and I press BUY, I assume it is not certain that it will be executed if the market is volatile and goes above this price.

Are these buttons useless as they should be BUY SELL MARKET BUTTONS and not BUY SELL LIMIT BUTTONS if I want to INSTANT BUY and INSTANT SELL irrespective of the volatility and momentum of the market?

9

Here is a summary of my questions asked above:

  1. If I place SLM for BUY, SLM for Stoploss and SLM for Target, do I need to have 3 times the margin?
    or the margin is set once any of the order executes?
    I assume that here I will only get MIS based leverage and not CO based leverage?

  2. Can I place BUY CO order (to get more leverage) and SLM for Target?
    So, if BUY CO is at 400 and reaches a separate SLM order of 410, I assume that CO as well as SLM Target (all orders) will be closed and exited. Please confirm.
    So, this means Rs.20 for CO and 20 for SLM Target. Please confirm.

  3. What is a correct way to use CO and exit after reaching the target?

Thanks.

10

  1. Yes, you will 3 times to place orders. So what you need to do is wait for your first order to execute. Once it executes, you will not need margin to place the SL and target orders.

  2. Yes you can use BO or CO for higher leverage. Target price if it is higher than current price, you need to place limit selling order. In CO, SLM order will be lesser than the current price. Whenever you want to exit, you have to modify the pending SLM order. Yes brokerage will be 20+20

  3. Suggest you to go through this video playlist on Kite and this this usermanual.

12

Thanks again so much. You’re very helpful. My doubts are clear now.
I assume that to benefit from leverage, I should wait for the LTP to cross my entry price and then I trigger CO with stop loss. Then when the LTP reaches near my target, I should exit the CO.
Please confirm if this is a god strategy in the morning at 9:16 am (volatility and momentum time) ?

Or,
To BUY above the LTP price, place SLM BUY (entry price) and wait for it to be executed. Then place LIMIT SELL (target), SLM SELL (stop loss)…
Or, just put SLM SELL (stoploss) and manually exit the order when it reaches the Target.

Please confirm which strategy is a good idea here?

Or, just open PI, look at the screen: PRESS QUICK BUY, set SLM SELL (stop loss), then look at the screen and press SELL when the target is achieved. Then cancel the SLM SELL order.

Please confirm.

The reason I am asking this is as I want to jump in the market at 9:16 to ride the wave and take profits and exit. And due to volatility and momentum, want to put stoploss for safety.

Please suggest what is a good idea here?

That’s all :smile:

Thanks so much for all your help. I am ready to jump in the market tomorrow morning!

13

You can use any option you want. What you find simple are always better, so maybe the 3rd option of you looking and triggering buy using quick orders.

Btw Good idea is to to not over leverage. :slight_smile:

14

Thanks Nitin so much for your help and that too in Sunday.
You’re amazing. Bug Hugs.

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