At what time you thought your strategy was working?

[Default]

There is no Holi Grail in the market that can make you money at all times. So when did you thought your strategy is working?
After 50, 100 , 500 trades?
Backtesting confidence?

[maddy_Des]

There is much misconception and confusion around the term “holy Grail”. It has become like a slang or derogatory term.
Ther are many philosophers, authors and thinkers who trade nothing but spend much more time in intellectual timepass.

You know one funny fact -

Same books, same authors, same traders who have written in their books
"There is no holy grail"
went on to write in the same text,
"You will make money even if you take trade as per the toss of a coin"

So do they mean Coin toss is a holy grail!?

[maddy_Des]

Basically whole universe of the trading startegies can be divided in two categories.

1. Breakout 2. Pullback

1. Trend Following 2. Mean Reversion

These bipoles are exact opposite. The strategy by which you are buying, there will be another trader who is selling using exact same startegy.

And funny fact: Both will be making money!!!

Moral of the story.

1. Strategy doesn’t matter.
2. But strategy which suits your style and temprament matters.
3. You will fail the strategy another is making money with.
4. One cannot say if strategy is working even after 50, 100, 500 trades,
5. Trading is like a cricket match and each trade is facing a new ball. Even if you know what kinda shot you need and c an play for a given type of a delivery, you need to look at various factors like field placement, condition of the team averall, current form of a bowler, your own form etc etc etc.
6. The moment you are comfirtable with the strategy you can declare it is working. One staregy I trade, I declared as working after making continuous losses for three month!!

[maddy_Des]

Also there is one BIG pitfall.

Sometimes market structure remain conducive to a specific strategy for months or even years. If you have watched interviews of some senior traders, you will find they all will talk about harshad mehta bull run. Just buy anything and you will make money. Many thought they were gods of stock market. and they have discovered some Holy Grail. Only to lose in next phase of the market.

So a strategy may become outdated by the time you complete 500 trades profitably even.
Beware

[Default]

@maddy_Des

The moment you are comfirtable with the strategy you can declare it is working

Yes, this is what I asked for experienced traders. At what point of time made one think that the strategy or rules one is following is working.

This thread may help for those newbies who can’t stick to one set of rules for a particular period of time.

[maddy_Des]

Again there is no objective answer to this question.
The issue of newbie traders not sticking to one strategy for long is actually a non issue.
Consider a trader who is impatient for entries but hesitate to exit. How can you tell such a guy to go on trading for weeks and months and bring on his own ruin?

I have experienced that a trader will continue to trade a strategy for a long time without hesitation and even if making losses continuously if that strategy suits his personality, style and temprament.

The people who are peddling this stupid idea that main problem with newbie traders is that they change their strategy quite often are actually hypocrits.

You need to enjoy your trading while preserving your capital ans not gambling it away. Simple.

There is only harm in forcing a newbie to trade a strategy that is complete mismatch to him and expect a profitable trader out of him.
Period.

Moral: Continuously experiment, change strategy as quite often as you want until you get the strategy that suits you. You wil not change it even if losing.

[maddy_Des]

Superbly said.

[Default]

@maddy_Des

The people who are peddling this stupid idea that main problem with newbie traders is that they change their strategy quite often are actually hypocrits.

Well, its mostly true. For New starters, they don’t know where to start and what to do. So they follow some people and try to understand whats going on. The problem is blind following. Its only after burning their capital they realize whats going on.

The solution is not reading books but to analyse what others are doing. Watch and learn is the motto.
Whats the use of having a car if you don’t know how to drive.

[Riyas_Ahamed]

I never came out of loss in option trading , since last 5+ years , yearly 50 % profit achieving and be compounding ,

My strategy are simple , I am using kite and sensibull only
Dos & Donts
I am living through option trading
I will trade only in option positional and expiray

Donts

I will never trade in cash intraday , future market etc
I will never gamble in the market

[Default]

Before 5 years, how you got confidence that the strategy or rules you were following is working?
and how much time it took for you to become good at it?
Followed books or people?

[Riyas_Ahamed]

@Default , I really luck when i am in dubai , before i work in university , there is one free class available for every employee in university , there is different free class available in free time you can choose one class and learn after you completed you will get a certificate

Free activity classes available in university is
1-GYM conducted by (Fitness first )
2- karate
3-Trading and investing conducted by (Bloomberg)
4- Drawing and Music conducted by( L’arm international )

in these free class i took 3rd class (trading and investing ) , one American professional teach me about the derivatives and investment , in these thing i learn major i like is ( how can convert loss into profit ) this topic is forced to me live for trading , when i got full confident i try to swim in the financial ocean , now i am a happy conservative trader

[Default]

I am doing CA Final, so know a bit about fundamentals.
but 0 about technicals.
I opened zerodha a/c in 2019 but didn’t even put money in it until march 2020.
Till then my thinking was to recover 300/- maintenance fee in a year. yes 300 in a year!
Then saw some MTM Screenshots of people on twitter and boom.

Till now got 15k+, lost 11k-.
Still I dont know what a strategy is. Long way to go. but its better to learn from people than from books especially from american authors.

[Default]

Thank you for taking your time to explain. You got amazing clarity.

@Gautam

Also if you are doing CA then you don’t have to necessarily jump into the markets, don’t get into the intraday craze and shit . Start doing fundamental analysis, use the bad times (when market fall more than 5-10%) to accumulate good stocks or fundamentally good but unknown stocks and start making a long term portfolio little by little. Not everyone can beat Mr. Jhunjhunwala but there are countless long term investors who have made substantial money just investing at the right stocks at the right time.

Yes. Investing is my long term goal, Trading is for capital accumulation for investing.

[TIMEFRAME]

@Default

but its better to learn from people than from books especially from american authors.

I think this is a misconception , most of these American authors are really done trading/investing & having that experience written books ,unlike Indian Authors , most of them do, just copy paste job. And coming to the question of this thread , Learning to know the "Phase "of the market & ones capital & execution will decide the success of a particular Strategy.

[tradepick]

@Default

There is no Holi Grail in the market that can make you money at all times. So when did you thought your strategy is working?
After 50, 100 , 500 trades?
Backtesting confidence?

I follow a different game. I try to see the trades that had hit stop losses and try to understand if there is any condition I can implement for its betterment.

[HSL]

@Riyas_Ahamed

Trading and investing conducted by (Bloomberg

Is there any online recorded or live ?

[Riyas_Ahamed]

@HSL it’s live every day I spen 1 hours in class for six month, learned all derivative adjustment , majorly I learn how we can trade without fear

This is a professional class in the world conducted by Bloomberg , for us free , others any body want to learn the course fee is AED 25k for six month , you can pay every month also, after I attend the class they will teach you in paper trading for one month , afterwards I don’t have any fear in the market

[Qrious_Kamal]

Riyas,

Learning from the Pros at Bloomberg. That is like learning to play football from Messi / Ronaldo. You were chosen one.

You are speaking about the “Derivative Adjustments”, could you provide an example of how it is being done? Or if you know any book or journal your teacher has written would also be helpful.

You have learnt from the Pros, and if you provide some examples everyone will benefit.

[Riyas_Ahamed]

@Qrious_Kamal My brother its really a long learning process , each and every strategy in option they have 5 kinds of adjustment ,in Bloomberg those people main motto of the option strategy is without loss and make 5 to 8 % per month target thats ultra level they will teach ,
one point i will discuss here

1- dont worry , dont fear - lets market can go any direction , we need to make 5 to 8% per month compulsory

these first point is impressed me to lear more ,

they teach me 6 strategy , every strategy they will take one month , you will become master in those strategy , No fear Only gain we will come out on every month ,
now i am working only in two to maximum three strategy , They recommended in those strategy choose only 3 strategy , and make money month and month, dont confuse yourself you are doing something in the market ,dont jump to find another strategy like a monkey climbing one tree to another

Bloomberg advised is

we are not came here to do a monkey business
we came here to make money - treat trading as business , dont look others , be an professional

[kidrow]

Hi there,

Would appreciate if you could elaborate on what you exactly mean by ‘context’? Maybe with a short descriptive example?

Maybe the more experienced traders do get what you mean, but as a newbie, I didn’t get it.

Thanks for your time.