One need to exit shorts first as they need more margins, later longs.
As mentioned above, exit shorts first, seems that’s the only way for now.
2 Likes
Yes, upto circuits only, still that is huge value to loose.
Can happen on futures also, but one require lots of money to move futures compared to options as futures require higher margins.
1 Like
With TER going away, can @nithin @siva Zerodha implement a config/setting (so that we DONT have to do it daily) where the settings define when I click on buy/sell/add in Kite it defaults to limit type order with limit price filled in the buy window and the filled in limit price to be configurable as well whether it to be LTP or mid of bid/ask or 1st bid/ask (The JS code I think already reads the LTP and bid/ask to give a nudge).
We used to have this kind of settings on NEST/Pi platforms too, now that we do NOT have either of them and TER going away, its high time these features are implemented and configurable, same for SL, should default to SL-L, otherwise too many clicks per order. If I place 200 orders (not modifications, those are additional clicks), I will end up clicking too many times. We needed this feature yesterday. This will help reduce risk on client side + to the broker as well.
Please make this configurable in Kite, so no one executes market order (unless they change at the time of execution or they intentionally have made settings for market orders).
Siva, Thanks, so you are confirming if we are exiting a multi-leg position by exiting the SHORT’s first then we are good from peak margin penalty point of view, Thanks!!
my obvious next follow-up question is, how will CC (clearing corporation) draw the line between the genuine trade and greedy trade.
Trade A: genuinely exiting a multi-leg position step by step so as to avoid the damage of market order.
Trade B: with the objective of taking benefit of huge margin benefit provided for hedged positions initiates a hedged position, and later removes the hedges so now he will continue to stay with a naked straddle, which otherwise would have attracted huge margins.
Question is how will CC know/decide which trade is genuine and which is not? and what is the mechanism to check this?
Can it so happen even if this is a genuine trade and I am exiting the short position first, I can be penalized??
Kite always remembers product type, what ever is preciously used it will open the same next time also, if you keep it to limit it won’t change unless you change it.
Also it will open with LTP only, will check on possibility with opening mid of bid/offer etc.
No concept of genuine trade, if you exit shorts first then there is no question of penalty.
@siva appreciate you looking at the possibility of adding this.
My experience with Kite remembering product type and order type is NOT consistent (this am saying even with what I experienced few seconds back and I place > 200 orders per day, some manually and some via kiteconnect API), I can always go to 100% API, but my ask for this feature was to make it consistent via settings/configs.
If you remember, we had this setting in NEST/Pi for per exchange/segment basis, and with this kind of config, even if I login on a new PC or incognito mode, the settings are downloaded and I can use the moment I login, I do not have to train Kite.
And the limit price defaulting to either 1st bid/ask or 2nd depth of bid/ask or LTP or mid of bid/ask or bid/ask +/- 0.05 via a configuration/setting would be really good, (If everyone gets the API they can do all of this and many more with API, but this should be available to add via Kite), if this is implemented via settings/config per segment/exchange for Kite similar to what we had in NEST.
Like I said I do not clear Kite’s cookies, even then I see inconsistency, not just that, lets say I have logged in and placed a limit order for an instrument and I am adding to the same instrument (without logging out, it is the same session and normal browser mode not incognito), it still goes to Market order type, this happened several times today.
[This settings/configs should be applicable for kite mobile too, consistent across and user will not have to train kite with orders]
Cheers!
Is this happening only in Zerodha? Or across all brokers?
Is it guaranteed that any open position wont be squared off even in futures in case of freak trade? or is this only for options?
For example, the freak trade in Muthoot Finance September Futures on 25th Aug.
Most likely it won’t , no need to worry about it.
Hey Siva,
Yesterday, I exited the short position first, instantaneously I received an e-mail from Zerodha that my “margin utilization has reached 108% of available funds” how do you explain this???
If you can let me know your positions at that time and what you closed I can try to let you know the reason.
Can you please explain the logic of why wouldn’t it be executed , if there is such a significant loss ( loss exceeding the value of my account ) , then why wouldn’t Zerodha’s RMS team close it?
How much amount you have, what is your loss? can you give with numbers.
for eg .
Shorted nifty 16450 CE at Rs 80 ( 1 lot ) and then price went up to 803. While there is only 1 L in my account , in such a case , the loss has far exceeded the account value , so what will happen in a situation like this?
Already replied multiple times above, anyhow if it is a freak trade it will revert back to ideal price to in a fraction of second, so by the time RMS checks everything will be normal, only for that fraction of sec you may have higher unrealized loss, so this is okay.
@siva , I understand that ,
I am just asking for assurance that the freak trade will not be squared off at that exorbitant
price. because if it does , it could wipe out 1 year’s of hard work in a second.