Nope, we just pass penalty charged by exchange.
That is the rule, maybe let them expire worthless and save on brokerage.
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Hi @nithin
I took some intraday option positions (call spreads). I tried to exit all my positions and entered LIMIT orders. So all the options brought got squared off (1st leg of trade) and all the sold options got squared off a little while after some time. And all this happened b/w 3:00- 3:20PM on expiry day. In between for a short span of time margin had gone up i think so.
Many derivative traders can fall into this scenario.
This is very common as I see while trading option strategies. Some time even when u try to exit all positions, order of execution might be very random.
I was charged 2.15 Lakhs as penalty by zerodha on total fund of 10 Lakh i.e > 20% of capital just wiped off. I have been trading in zerodha for more than 6 years, i just got scared with this and took off all the money fearing that all my fund could be taken off as penalty.
@nithin , Please look into this. Bcoz, many people might lost all the money they had.
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Can you please message me your ID?
Got your ID, let me get this checked.
I am completely helpless. I asked support team to give me the entire details why this high penalty is being charged i.e. the timestamps, short time for which margin is not maintained etc. details with some authorization so that I can proceed legally with exchange/SEBI. But only thing they could say is this:
This is to inform you that on 29th you had total required was 4578816.29 (50% additional margin) EOD margin was collected 954716.22 so shortfall of 3624100.07 according to this you was charged a peak penalty by the exchange.
I was charged 2.15 Lakhs as penalty which by anyway is huge. I maintained margin through out the day and end of day my margin is 8.15L left as cash in my account. And definitely zerodha wonât let me take trade worth Rs. 45L if i have only 9.5Lakhs.
@nithin @siva-reddy please look into this matter.
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Checked on this, this is 5th time in last one month you are caught of margin shortfall and hence penalty of 5% is levied, maybe from now donât do the same with any broker you are dealing with.
Can understand if the positions are not closed by end of trading session and carried over night which was the case in the last 4 times. And also the charge was very less. Now the penalty 5% is calculated on short fall of 36 Lakhs and that too margins are maintained at the end of the day based on margin statements. I think this margin spike has occurred between 2 legs of trade for a very short span.
You should be giving some time to your client in that case to close positions as they are limit orders might take some short time bcoz they are worthless options or at least RMS team should have closed the positions if there is sudden spike in the margin for such a short span.
But instead, it is charged on the whole spike of that short span. Whole capital could get wiped off if this is the case.
As said above broker never charges penalty, exchanges take screenshots randomly during the day and charge penalty, broker just collects it. This is same with any broker.
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What if the capital is some crores of rupees and person lost everything bcoz of using intraday leverage and got stuck with margin spike in between 2 trades while exiting positions?
Also because it is hefty penalty of 2.15 Lakh rupees for me. I need to have proper information as a client like at between what time stamps the short fall occured, how much span it is, etc. details with proper authorization of the document so that we can proceed legally on exchange or complain to SEBI. Please provide these details.
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You can create ticket and let me know.
I understand it is charged by exchange but definitely broker could have easily avoided this scenario for client by triggering your RMS system if the margin exceeds some threshold percentage or some tens of lakhs or crores as it has a high chance of wiping our entire capital.
20210510536421. Please look into this. This was created day before yesterday and itâs still open.
We immediately send margin shortfall email when account goes negative, will get that ticket checked.
Yes Siva. I agree this a good part that automated message or mail is sent whenever margin shortfall. But just try this, execute some option strategy like call spreads etc. and try to exit all the legs at once. This will trigger 1-2 shortfall messages and mails. For a trader, who does take lot of these kind of trades that too on expiry, u mail box just gets filled with these bcoz it randomly exits the orders and definitely the margin spike happen lot of time during a day. In these scenarios , mails are of little help.
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Hello @siva-reddy, does the peak margin penalty is also charged on intraday margin shortfall? Or is it only for the overnight positions?
Peak margin itself means penalty for intraday shortfall also, if not then there is no difference to earlier.
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@siva-reddy
if I am charged a peak margin penalty, then I will get some mail or some notification or have to chk ledger every day to keep eye on that?
Yeah, you need to check ledger.
The only option seems now is to exit the short position 1st and then only execute the squate off long position. @siva-reddy what can be practical problems if system enforces the above.
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